PDA

View Full Version : out of control showjumper at Red Hill



lissa
27-03-00, 03:48 PM
Did anybody else witness the dangerous incident that happened at Red Hill show where a riderless showjumper departed the showjumping ring and galloped through horses, riders and spectators hitting one poor unfortunate chestnut horse whose rider hit the deck. Both seemed to be o.k. at the time but the horse was hit very very hard and I hope no internal damage was done. It was very frightening being on a horse who was narrowly missed. Very lucky nobody was killed.

Flocky
27-03-00, 04:36 PM
Yeah, I was there, but the person who the horse ran over, was actually on the ground, standing next to her horse when she got trampled... I was maybe 10 metres away from the scene.. What they should have, espically in situations that 'may' occur is to have a shutted entrance...!

Jan Heine
27-03-00, 05:45 PM
Yep I was there and my report will be available on Tuesday - but in the meantime - OK let's say first of all what happened - the rider was in the maiden D Grade and fell off very heavily - the horse took off and unfortunately there was thin rope used as the arena line and the horse obviously did not see it until it was too late and when it hit the rope the plastic "bucket type things" hanging on it went flying and terrified the horse who them took off "through" the rope bringing it down. Yes it ran straight through the hack ring and out the other side, down the huge embankment and out onto the road before it was finally cornered and stopped.

On its way through the hack ring it did bash through someone - Flocky was obviously there close by for that bit and has described it - I was at Ring One showjumping arena.

Now I seriously don't know what can be done to safe guard against this type of thing happening - but it must also be said that earlier in the day a pony club horse (16.2hh and scared) escaped its owner and raced through Ring One showjumping arena whilst a horse was on course nearly causing a nasty accident there and then running through to the hack ring also.

I have been at many shows where show hacks have escaped and run straight through our horses (remember that means two stallions in yards attached to the truck) and been abused by the hackies when we have actually tried to herd their horses away from our truck for everyone's safety.

It is interesting because these things do happen when you have large numbers of horses together and I would love to hear some suggestions about how to avoid them without getting into the hysteria of it all - no-one was seriously injured (through good luck not good management) and so let's try and find solutions before someone is hurt - and let's not turn this into a Hackies versus Showjumpers and vice versa!

showee
28-03-00, 02:03 AM
I too witnessed what happened as I was with flocky at the time. What the society could do in future would be to provide adequate bunting that the horses can see and have an appropriate marshalling areas as there were horses everywhere, as well as spectators with prams and small children walking through the crowded horse area. Larger warm up rings were needed for both hacks and SJ I thought. Too many horses in too small an area, recipe for disaster.
On another note the A&B was a fantastic spectacle and the hack championships were very hotly contestd with many top horses out in action.

No contest.
28-03-00, 02:06 AM
Jan I think you may be seeing something here that others may not. Horses of all disciplines can be terribly dangerous, I can't see any suggestion in these posts to get a hack versus showjumper thing going. It was one of those horrible things that happen and the general feeling from hack ringside was that it could have been a lot worse, thank goodness it wasn't. The rider collected was mounted at the time, and I think the loose horse ended up on the dirt road, hence I gather the call for shut gate.

Fi
28-03-00, 02:32 AM
Jan
It was a terrible sight and no debate needs to occur regarding Hackies V SJ. I was there and have discussed the show with others yesterday. I believe that maybe Red Hill as a society need to look at extending the show over two days. My problems with the show, and let me say here and now it is run brilliantly and all credit needs to go to the committee. However with the HUGE number of events and classes there are just too many horses on a small ground at the one time.

We took a new Galloway that hadnt been shown for 2 years, we arrived mid morning and tried to negotiate our way to a work ring to let her have a look around. The Hack work ring was the size of my inner city back yard with 40+ horses ponies, adults and children going around. Our Mare, who is genuinely quiet, heart began to race, after 5-10minutes she was a sweaty mess. We then decided that this was fighting a loosing battle, took the mare back to float, washed her down, let her graze in the cow paddock a mile from the ring where we were parked and relaxed for a couple of hours. Working out the rings were closing for lunch at 2.00pm, we got the mare re saddled just prior and went back to work in a quieter vacant ring during the lunch breaks. All this worked for us and we made the final ring of the day, and went Champion. But this may not work for the person that has a couple of horses or kids.

My concerns for a show like Red Hill is all the Hacks enter through a small entrance, with most people standing around blocking the entrance, a large truck parked right on the gateway with all their preparation gear laid out also blocking the entrance and ten feet back from all of this is a steep enbankment with a drop to a bitumen road way. This is a disaster waiting to happen. When we did finally enter the ring later in the day we marshalled our selves through the showjumping entrance. But as I was watching the class I was standing with my non horse Mother, who came for the day, there was a showjumper lunging his horse on the side of an embankment next to the bar and as well as jumpers warming up and spectators. Her comments were "dont these shows have proper area's for you to work your horses." This is the problem.

The accident on Saturday was just that an accident and luckily for all involved it didnt have a worse outcome. But with such large spectator numbers that wander through horse areas and huge numbers or horses in confined areas with the hustle and bustle of this show something needs to be addressed now before a tragady occurs and we all dance about saying I told you so.

Jan Heine
28-03-00, 03:08 AM
I have been fairly chastised for being over sensitive and I agree I deserved it! Unfortunately there has been a bit of friction regarding showjumpers at Agricultural shows lately and I think I am becoming super sensitive (most unlike me generally speaking).

There have been some good suggestions already so far and all very valid so perhaps when there are a few more entries here over the next couple of days the plan might be to print it off and send it to the Red Hill Society.

I agree that the show could be greatly improved by being two days - over the last couple of years the showjumping area has been whittled down to smaller and smaller (remember I can only speak from that perspective and I am sure the Hackies have problems too) areas and the warm up areas were actually dangerous - both being small and on the side of embankments. The "rope" is NOT a good aidea - bunting can at least be seen by the horse and there is a better chance of stopping them.

lissa
28-03-00, 03:46 AM
wow Jan did you jump on your high horse so to speak. I had no intention of this becoming a hackie versus showjumpers debate but merely asked if anybody else had seen the incident.
I apologize if i offended you. I think your idea of maybe printing and sending a copy of this to the R.H. soc. is a good idea. I agree with others that the show is extremely well run and is a credit to them but the congestion starts with getting into the grounds then the parking then the exhibiting and finally the leaving of the grounds with cars, floats and trucks trying to go two ways down a very narrow road is very difficult. One thing I must mention is the work surface of the rings I thought was great, apart from being hard (everywhere is at the moment) the grass was mowed and the surface flat.

Jan Heine
28-03-00, 04:07 AM
and I agree that the actual Jumping Ring Number One was a beautiful surface - it always is which is why generally the top horses in the State are there - this year it unfortunately clashed with the Australian Championships but there were still a lot of good jumpers there. I agree that getting in and out of the place was very difficult and where we had to park (down the bottom of the embankment quite near the gate in) they put us on the roadside which meant that we had horses actually on the roadway which made it damned near impossible for trucks to get past and very difficult for cars and floats. When I walked around the place I found that if the attendants had actually directed people as to where to park it could possible have been a lot easier with a lot more trucks and floats being able to be parked in more appropriate places - rather than just letting people go higgledy piggeldy - also a problem was the showjumpers (yep I'll pick on them when they need it) who obviously went down the night before and set up yards which they didn't take down thus using up a lot of valuable space at a one day show.
Actaully I love Red Hill Show and was the Hack Ring Announcer for quite a few years - this year was the first for a long time that I didn't do it.

showie
28-03-00, 06:12 AM
The horse tat was run into was"My Fetish" owned by Micheal and Franny Christie and was ridden by Caroline Reid. Evidently both are sort of ok. The poor horse that was bolting was doing so out of sheer terror. The bridle was around his legs attached only by the reins being through rings.
It wouldn't have mattered what sort of ring ropes they had he would have gone straight through them.
Nothing would have stopped him, thus he flattened the galloway. It was no ones fault,unfortunately when you have 1000lbs of horse flesh frightened out of their mind accidents happen. Maybe R H could go back to show jumping and harness on one arena and hackies and breeds on the other.

BL
28-03-00, 12:37 PM
At Gisborne Show last weekend, one of my friends horse got a fright from a rearing horse nearby. It took off, the rider fell before the first ring, the horse ran through the first ring, jumped the rope into the second and then just ploughed through the remaining 5 rings!!! Horse scattered in all directions! One poor showie, got hit in the chest by the rope and her horse took off, then while her horse was bolting it ran closly passed another horse and she got hit in the chest again by the horses head, luckily not falling off!
It was this horses first show since racing, and if it wasn't for the rearing and bucking horse in the warm up area it wouldn't have taken off.
This also brings up the discussion when should you be taking your horse to competitions?? Surly if your horse bucks and carries on you wouldn't take it to a show amoung other horses, until it is out of the habbit and you know it wont put other horses in danger. Just like another incident occured at a different show when the rider knew her horse kicked yet still took it out without warning people and a horse I know got kicked and was out for a week!
*** BL ***

Shannon
29-03-00, 03:26 AM
Not having a go at you at all BL but my horse kicks ONLY if other stupid people let their horses come too close to mine. (He has only kicked out once at a show and it wasn't my fault at all, I have been able to avoid it because I am always concious of keeping a distance) I am forever telling people don't come too close, or can you please move over a bit and they look at me like I am dumb!

Some people have no show etiquette (sp) at all, there is no way I would go too close to another horse. Alot of horses don't like others getting too close to them it is just their nature therefore they WILL kick.

I get looked at like I am dumb when I am forever telling people to move over and I am always really polite about it too it gets so frustrating.

The one time he actually kicked out was when I was in a led class standing him up, all of a sudden a lady run in the class late and ran right up behind the horses. The first horse had it's ears flat back and it's bum dropped about to kick and mine bit me hard and kicked out just missing the lady.

I apologised and felt embarassed but later after thinking about it - it was her fault. The judge even come up to me afterwards and said that it wasn't my fault at all (and no I didn't know her). People that I didn't know that were watching also come up to me and said that it wasn't my fault. But I'm sure that lady and her friends would have been bitching about me and my horse.

Sorry to ramble on but this really annoys me, people think that you and your horse are bad because they will kick but it is actually up to them to keep their distance from ALL horses. I do everything I can to keep away.

I also hate it when you are going around the circle at the beginning of the class waiting to be called in and people let their horse follow you right up their bum, I go fast, go slow, go wide, cut in and they let their horse just sit there. I have even told people to pass me and again the blank stares. It causes my horse to rush around, he can't concentrate or work properly and it ruins my chance of getting called in!

There that's my whinge...

Jan Heine
29-03-00, 04:42 AM
Shannon your comments are interesting because they mirror almost exactly my complaints about some of the shows we attend. And I am sorry to have a go at hackies but that does seem to be where most of our problems come from. We have two stallions on our team and we try very hard to park well away from everyone else (not because they are badly behaved but rather because it gives us peace of mind) and you can back it in that someone (generally the hackies) will park as close as possible to us - we always ask (very politely) if they have a mare on board and also explain that we have two stallions so could they please park further away. So often (and usually the mare owners) the reply is "well keep them under control and it won't bother my mare"! Well that just isn't the point now is it!? Our boys have yards attached to the truck and so if by chance they were to pull back they are still contained in their yards so we do all we can for safety but it is very hard when others won't "play fair" - and your point about riding right up the bum of another horse - you have no idea how many do this to the stallions (and again it is usually the mare owners) and it is after all in the nature of the horse to kick first , ask questions later - surely people should be expected to use common sense around horses.
The other thing I just love is the people with babies in strollers who push the stroller right tight behind a horse (either tied to truck or ridden) - now that is fine if the horse is used to kids screaming frominside a stroller - ours don't happen to be used to this as we don't have littlies! Our horses are used to big dogs (I have Great Danes) but others aren't so my dogs aren't taken to the shows - not the appropriate place for them! Boy it must be whinge morning because I have just had a big 'un - but I agree with you Shannon!

DONNA
29-03-00, 05:50 AM
I am going to have to jump in here. Arent you in fact by your last post starting up the debate between hackies verses showjumpers when in fact all equestrian displines do have their own ignoramus'. Just for the record I am not a hackie. However I do agree with the riding up the bum of other horses and I hate those prams.

Shannon
29-03-00, 07:07 AM
Hey I'm a hackie and I started this whole thing. I was just stating my problems as was Jan, of course every discipline has it's problems.

I have had a problem with jumpers but of course that doesn't mean all of them are the same just as all hackies aren't the same.

Some of the jumpers I have come across at aggie shows seem to have no control of their horses and the horses are extremely highly strung hanging around in the hackie warm up area dancing and prancing all over the place getting in the way and upsetting other horses.

But I have had more problems with hackies having no show manners.

DONNA
29-03-00, 07:20 AM
Shannon, my point exactly...

Jan Heine
29-03-00, 07:45 PM
Sorry guys - you are right - I was being a bad girl - didn't mean to start a hackie slagging match - and you are right that some showjumpers have no control of their horses either - I guess the point is that in all disciplines we need more common sense!

lissa
30-03-00, 06:50 AM
Jan I dont think that we equine persons, be us hackies, showjumpers or what ever,are entirely to blame for our animals at times being out of control. I suggest that the event organisers could perhaps have a bit more forethought with the organization. If it means putting the hacks or showjumpers in different arenas/areas or maybe the rings close for lunch while they run novelty events or harness events and maybe try not to put the childrens classes on when there is other unsafe activities being judged.
Perhaps if some of the horse sections at shows were organized by horse people instead of Freddy Farmer, Cathy Cook or Sharon Showgirl then maybe we would all attend a much more enjoyable and safe day out. I am not saying that all shows are run by these people but lets face it some shows certainly seem to be..